I don't know if anything can be done to gently change things, but a majority of member submissions in the gallery seem to be in colour. This is kind of drifting away from the emphasis on pencil drawing, going into painting and computer art and such.



Brenda Hoddinott's books, thus far, don't cover painting and colour. They want to help people get a foundation and ability using the simplest, most familiar tools: the pencil. Colour work and other materials add new complexities. I don't suggest anything forceful, but I would encourage people to submit the best of what they have in pencil art especially.

Normally I kind of watch from the sidelines when controversial issues are brought up. So also with this one. Yet, I must admit, and this is the reason I post this, that I felt a bit of incongruity when I saw color art in the gallery. Don't know why....just didn't seem right somehow. But this has nothing to do with the art I saw. What was in color was great.

I agree with Draco that the site should remain strictly drawing. There are many other sites that deal with painting, pastel, and other color mediums. However, I want to add that I would have no problem with Gallery items that use pen/ink or color pencil as this remains true to the techniques used in creative drawing (i.e. shading, shaping, hatching, etc...). Its just when submissions using painting, pastel, collages with manmade and natural objects, etc... are allowed, that the site feels as if its "drifting" away from it's original intentions.

Thanks for bringing this up, Draconian.

Eric

This is interesting discussion. I guess ultimately it is up to Brenda. I suppose I am more guilty than anyone is this regard, and perhaps this is even aimed gently at me. Drac, I see your point. What drives me to do this is simply interesting people in art, attracting them to explore the site, giving them something to do/see in the forums, and helping others. I feel like this "group" is heavily forum driven (as are most sites like this), and though the lessons are incredible...people just do not stay around if they perceive the group dead, or s-u-p-e-r slow. You have seen this first hand Draconian. Add to that that Brenda herself was the first to introduce paintings into the gallery, and I hope you can understand why I personally have so freely been adding non-drawing type material (though, all my paintings start as charcoal or pencil drawings).

I don't mind if the site sticks to drawing ,you can draw in colour as well as graphite etc.but it is nice to post work that you have finished no matter what the medium.perhaps we can stick to the working drawings and then the finished product if we take it further.that is what art is all about taking it further....chers Lorrir.aka costan.

Dragonshade, oh, you're right. Brenda did kick things off with some colour drawings in the gallery. So it's of course permitted, so far.



I wasn't aiming at you in particular.

Lol... also the most viewed image in the gallery is Brenda's painting

I do look forward to Brenda's feelings on this though.

Fascinating discussion you guys!

I first learned to draw in graphite, and this was my only medium for many years. Then I decided to try drawing with colored media such as colored pencils and pastels. My final goal was to learn to draw with wet media, my favorite being oil paints. Hence, I define drawing as the application of a medium to a surface so as to produce a visual image. I don’t consider the tools used for making marks an important element, be they pencils, sticks, brushes, fingers or toes!

Regardless of the medium, the transition from black and white to color necessitates a solid foundation in creating a full range of values. Whether an artwork is in color or not – the measure of an accomplished artist is the ability to create a full range of values.

As an experiment, artists who work in color should periodically change their works from color to black and white (or grayscale) in a computer imaging program, and examine the subsequent values. I’m going to upload a black and white version of the painting I have in the gallery, so you can compare them and see what I mean by a full range of values.

In other words, there isn’t a right or wrong! People simply give works different names based on the medium. To throw a few more spices into the pot, I even use the phrase "paint" with colored pencils.

Hence the old adage “A rose by any other name is still a rose”!

Brenda

WELL SAID BRENDA..lORRIR

Brenda... I am always learning from you I had not even thought to greyscale my paintings. I have been so worried with colors, and hues that I have conciously paid little attention to true value. Though I still find myself "squinting" at my paintings as I go (so perhaps there is something subconciously going on).

LOVE the new pic (avatar) by the way


Ray

Yes well said specially because i just signedup for premium mainly to learn coloring/painting .

For what it is worth, if anything, most of us didn't even know this site was here until we had done some art work in whatever medium caught our fancy. It wasn't until after I got into some quagmires that I tried to find some REAL help. By accident I found this site and started with all the basic drawings. I posted some of my acrylics to show where I've been, and to see if there is any improvement in the new drawings. But a simple delete button takes all things off.
Slim

this Site is not Drifting away from drawing as drawing is the Core of all medium

just chill and be CREATIVE !!

I happen to prefer working in color. This thread doesn't seem to make any sense.

IMHO (and in that of many others) drawing is the root and foundation all the arts, painting included. To me, painting just feels like drawing with a brush. (Haven't tried toes yet Brenda, thanks for the tip!) The line between painting and drawing is always a little blurred. In fact, the winner of the Archibald prize for painting in Australia in 2004, Craig Ruddy, was taken to court because his "painting" was done mainly in charcoal! The outcome? Craig Ruddy won and the prize stood. Also, ppl who specialise in working in chalk pastels sometimes call their works "pastel paintings", even though it is a dry medium and mainly laid on in lines.

But i see the point Draconian is trying to make, and agree that we should return to tonal drawing often. Mea culpa there i'm afraid, but i'm working on it... :-)

I Draw in color...I see in color...I draw what i see...lol. i get the piont...but drawing is a wide scope of medium...i draw in oils...pencils...charcol...color pencils...watercolor...what ever i have in the cupboard at the time...lol....and i draw on canvas ...paper...side walks...etc what ever is at hand...the piont being that i draw...lol

I think by restricting members to just one type of drawing medium, it would prevent any form of individual creative expression by the members here. If one wants to start a thread focusing on one particular medium and style then that's fine. But limiting the entire site to just one medium and style would be a bit much.

I totally agree with UKartist that that drawing in it self is a very basic of every artwork here no matter if it is colored pencil ,acrylic or oil colors..Also I think that colors have power of expression in themselves so it would be a shame to get rid of it.

maybee there could be a section for painting too, as this is a very good site with good members. im more of a painter but am trying to learn to draw from this site, i like people to see my work and if they want to look and enjoy it whats the harm in that, surley you drawers like all art and are not as small minded to just brush off all other methods without looking at?