This is my first portrait, it's of my sister.
Something is just not right about her mouth and jaw line, at least I think that's what's wrong with it????
I haven't finished it obviously but I can't seem to get past this bit!

Please, please help, it's driving me mad!!!

I've attached the reference photo. I'm sorry I don't know how to put them side by side.

Andrea[attachmentid=4436][attachmentid=4437]

I put the two pictures together and the first thing I noticed is that the head on your drawing seems a little too short or too wide. Your sister's head is slimmer than your drawing. I would have to measure to find out which way you are off. This is what I do in my drawings.

I agree with you also about the mouth and jaw line. Her jaw is egg shaped but you have it shaped more like a pear.

I think you did an excellent job on the hair. Just keep practicing.

Thanks, thats a good observation re her jaw shape and general head shape.
Sometimes you get too close to these things and need a outsiders opinion, if you know what I mean!
What program do you use to put the pictures side by side?


Andrea

I have Jasc Paint shop pro 7. I have also used MS Paint, but I like Jasc PSP better. If you don't mind I would like to do a simple sketch (ten or fifteen minutes) and put it with the picture to give you an example of what I do. Her face is a little two dark in the picture because it is in the shadow, but I think I can lighten it to see the details enough.

Oh, after I examined the picture more I think I see what you saw in the chin. Her jaw is slightly pear shaped but I think you might have exaggerated it. This is easy to do. Teeth are something else that you don't want to exaggerate. You want to under draw them or blurr them slightly.

[quote name='BRB' date='Apr 23 2007, 09:58 PM' post='19485']
'I have Jasc Paint shop pro 7. I have also used MS Paint, but I like Jasc PSP better.'

Do you have to pay for them, if so do you know of any free applications that can put images side by side?

'If you don't mind I would like to do a simple sketch (ten or fifteen minutes) and put it with the picture to give you an example of what I do. Her face is a little two dark in the picture because it is in the shadow, but I think I can lighten it to see the details enough.'

Thanks that would be great. I look forward to it...

She does have a slight pear shape to her chin, it's a family thing from my Dad's side!!!

Andrea

MS Paint comes with all Microsoft Windows operating systems. I got Jasc PSP several years ago and I have no idea what it would cost now. I'm sure there are freeware programs that will do it. I'm not sure if Gimp will do it. I will check.

The drawing isn't perfect but I think it is close to the true composition. I hope it helps.

I searched the Internet for Jasc PSP and it took me to Corel. They must have took Jasc over. All the links to Jasc softwear said the product was unavailable.

Wow, thanks. You certainly got the shape of her jaw & head right.
I wish I could do such accurate drawings in such a short period of time.
You did a fantastic job of her mouth, I obviously need to practice.
This is my first portrait drawing so it's great to get advice from an expert like you.
I have got MS Paint and have managed to import both images. Yipee!!!
Will let you know how I get on

Andrea

Andrea ...you have the best at portraits helping you ...Bob does awasome work consistantly
thanks for helping out Bob.

Ok, I've done some more work on it.
I think the jaw line and mouth is better now, but the eyes still aren't right.
I've reduced a lot of the shading as I think it was making her look older!

Any suggestions on how to improve it? It's still not right.

Andrea

I think you did excellent. And be thankful that it doesn't perfect to you. None of my finished works ever look perfect to me. That critical eye is what enables you to continue to improve.

I would say study the shadows. Shadows always give me trouble.

Thanks Bob. I wouldn't have thought anything gave you trouble looking at your portraits!
The eyes are still not right but I have a tenancy to over do things. So I think I'll stop adding to her now!
I'm quite pleased with the mouth, it really is a case of less is more!

Not sure if it needs a background though. I notice on some of your portraits you use a shadow as a background.
What do you think?


Andrea

If I may make a suggestion...certainly Im not a big people face portrait artist, however I know graphite in my drawings...so please take this at face value (HAHAHAHA I made a funny!!!)

OK, Bob is very correct, you need to work on the shadows in the body and face...more shadow under the hair to the left (your left) and at the neckline on the right...Then start to shadow around the eyes to accentuate the brows and cheekbones...Give a little shading at the top of the bosom to shape the chest area...

Perhaps, and this is a big perhaps, shorten her left (your left) shoulder to try and push her body at an angle away from the viewer, right now it looks like she is facing spot on to the viewer...

I have to applaud you on doing a person portrait, you are doing very well in your progress...mine generally look like ET when Im finished, so KUDOS to you!!

Cheers.

Paul

He He!
No seriously, thanks Paul, all very usefull observations.
How do I shorten her shoulder? Do you mean the viewers left shoulder?
I was worried about shadowing around her eyes in case it aged her! Perhaps I need to be more light handed!
What do you think about a background?

Human portraits are certainly not in my comfort zone, I also prefer animals!

Andrea

One thing you can think about concerning backgrounds is a darker background helps when the area is white, like in blonde hair. But it depends on your personal taste and on other things in the picture concerning how dark the back ground should be. I usually like a light back ground that doesn't take away from the features of the face. To me the drawing will look "cleaner" with less background.

This is just my opinion but, because the hair is a mid-tone in your drawing, I would leave the background white or very light, like a slight shadow.

bob

Hi Andrea,

Yes, the viewers left shoulder, which would be her right shoulder...
I would suggest shortening it by pulling it back into the body somewhat, just like foreshortening an arm...with a bit of well placed shadowing, it will give the illusion/impression that it is sliding away from the viewers eyes...

If you REALLY look at the image, you will see that there is shadow around the eyes, and this makes sense, as the eyes sit in pockets that are inset under the brow and over the cheek...try a little mid grade shading, and if it needs it, add some darker shading closest to the eyes...just make sure there are no wrinkles when you are done...then you might be in serious trouble...

Bob is correct in his explaination about background...if the subject is dark, then leave the background light, however to make the portrait 'pop' off the paper, use some shading in around areas that are light in the portrait, like exposed skin, or blonde hair...

I would suggest using some tracing paper, and adding some shading to it, and placing it over your drawing, around where you think you might want shading in the background...that way it will allow you to get an idea of 1. whether you need any shading, and 2. the level of shading required

I hope that helps.

Cheers.

Paul

Thanks for all your advice guys It really is great when you can ask for help in your hour of need and get it. I love drawspace, but it's the members that make it really special.

I will have a play with it today and then post the finished product!

Andrea

Ok, I've had a play with it, added some background shading and other shading.
The eyes still aren't right, but I've erased them so much I don't think there is much paper left!
I would welcome any comments. Do you think it needs anything else?

Andrea

Hmmm, is your scan stretched???

Its kinda hard to make observations if the image is skewed like that, could you repost just the finished image? We can use the original photo from what you have posted above...Thanks!!

Cheers.

Paul

Sorry Paul, I thought it didn't quite look right when I viewed it!

Hope this one is better, it's a photo of the picture not a scan.