Ernest Friedman-Hill
Sep 28 2008, 04:49 PM
Use this thread to post completed portraits for comments You can get praise or critique -- let us know which you're interested in hearing! All skill levels are welcome.
[ The previous "Portrait Gallery" thread, which has become rather long, is still available
here. ]
Ernest Friedman-Hill
Oct 4 2008, 03:25 AM
Hmmm... OK, well, I'll start. This is a little unusual for me. I do quickies that don't look this polished, and I do six-hour jobs that look nicer; this 90-minute portrait is a good compromise I rarely am able to strike. It's my son, showing off a little "snowman" he made out of tomatoes from our garden and toothpicks. I think the hand came out decently well; hands still elude me.
Click to view attachment[Edit: I replaced the original photo with a better one, now that the sun's up!]
rjblanchette
Oct 4 2008, 11:58 AM
QUOTE (Ernest Friedman-Hill @ Oct 4 2008, 05:25 AM)

This 90-minute portrait is a good compromise.
Click to view attachmentHi Ernest,
That is a very good job in 90 minutes. Good proportions and I imagine it is also a very good likeness. The hand looks okay with the exception of the thumb which seems to be lacking just a bit of definition.
The values in the drawing are light, which would be expected because you have not spent a lot of time layering, but the values in the hair and eyes are darker and seem to be out of balance with the rest of the drawing. Maybe this was intentional to emphasis those things?
In any case that was the first thing that struck me when I looked at the drawing.
mmmmmmme
Oct 4 2008, 02:46 PM
Ernest,
What a sweet drawing of your son!
I'd have to agree about the thumb, needs some tweaking maybe, but really valiant effort considering you're not accustomed to drawing hands. If this were my drawing I'd probably add some tomatoe plants growing in the background to help the viewer understand what this sculpture is made of.
Your son will surely appreciate this in years to come, a real treasure. Thanks for allowing this humble beginner to voice her opinion.
Ernest Friedman-Hill
Oct 4 2008, 03:00 PM
Hi RJ, Melinda,
Thanks for the feedback. Yeah, the values aren't that subtle in this; it is indeed partly due to the time factor, although I think it's also partly the paper; it's a very cheap, thin, smooth paper in a sketch pad from the dollar store! I was definitely not trying to emphasize the top of his head.
I agree that the thumb looks weird. It's exactly end-on in the photo, surrounded by the ball part of the palm; it was tricky to do and I didn't quite manage it. That's really where the shoulder is, though; he's holding the tomato man against his face with his arm in an awkward position.
Kaly
Oct 4 2008, 05:09 PM
I also agree on that thumb, but it must be in a very dificult position

hands can be very tricky I always try to hide them

other than that I think its great, I love how you did the hair hightlights.
Hrymfaxe
Oct 4 2008, 07:19 PM
Hi Ernest
It is indeed a good portrait and you have caught a lot of expression in a short time. Some proportions are a little off; one eye is slightly bigger than the other, but otherwise I'm impressed with how you have rendered his face - he does indeed look like a small boy, still with some of that babyfat and roundness that doesn't disappear until we turn teenagers.
As the others have pointed out, something is strange about the thumb. It may be photographic distortion.. But, perhaps more importantly, I didn't understand from the picture that his hand is right next to his face. I thought he was holding it outwards. Perhaps it might be clearer if you included more of his arm, connecting it to the shoulder, and showing us how it is foreshortened? And it looks like the light is coming from the upper left corner, so there might have been some shadow on his chin, just to emphasize the closeness?
Anyway, it is a lovely drawing that I'm sure he will treasure (once he is passed those teenage years when parents can only embarrass

)
Ernest Friedman-Hill
Oct 4 2008, 07:28 PM
Hi Marie,
Nice to "see" you!
These things are actually all connected: the eye is smaller because the hand is actually smooshing that side of his face upwards a bit; you can actually see that in the odd shape of the mouth, but it's not very obvious around the eye. I guess I picked this up to draw because it has a lot of challenging aspects, but I just did it on a doodle pad as an experiment. I should have tried to emphasize how his hand is compressing the face.
In any case it's it's funny that several folks have mentioned how Zachary will treasure this someday. He's up to his elbows in drawings by his Dad, and I don't think this one will specifically matter that much

QUOTE (Hrymfaxe @ Oct 4 2008, 03:19 PM)

Hi Ernest
It is indeed a good portrait and you have caught a lot of expression in a short time. Some proportions are a little off; one eye is slightly bigger than the other, but otherwise I'm impressed with how you have rendered his face - he does indeed look like a small boy, still with some of that babyfat and roundness that doesn't disappear until we turn teenagers.
As the others have pointed out, something is strange about the thumb. It may be photographic distortion.. But, perhaps more importantly, I didn't understand from the picture that his hand is right next to his face. I thought he was holding it outwards. Perhaps it might be clearer if you included more of his arm, connecting it to the shoulder, and showing us how it is foreshortened? And it looks like the light is coming from the upper left corner, so there might have been some shadow on his chin, just to emphasize the closeness?
Anyway, it is a lovely drawing that I'm sure he will treasure (once he is passed those teenage years when parents can only embarrass

)
Hrymfaxe
Oct 4 2008, 07:45 PM
Hi Ernest,
Yes it has been a while hasn't it? I have been lurking around, but haven't had the time to actually participate. It's nice to be back again.
I see what you mean now, about his hand influencing the face. And I can imagine that it was a challenging pose to draw, which is always fun. And it's great to take these up as doodles, because the speed aspect makes it ok to not get everything completely right. I have just been thumb-nailing quite a bit today and really enjoyed it, because it loosens me up for when I do the actual drawing.
QUOTE (Ernest Friedman-Hill @ Oct 4 2008, 09:28 PM)

In any case it's it's funny that several folks have mentioned how Zachary will treasure this someday. He's up to his elbows in drawings by his Dad, and I don't think this one will specifically matter that much

Hehehehe, so this one will just end up somewhere in the middle of a huge portfolio entitled Dad's doodles.
kim1963
Oct 5 2008, 03:02 AM
wow for 90 min. its outstanding .. the thumb yes is maybe off but as kaly said it is a challenging angle ...you have done well with this .
I wish to submitt this pencil to your criticisms. A newspaper photo (that I have lost) was the source for the drawing. I intended to draw a poor and laborious woman, am not looking for resemblance. Some care was made for the lighting, eyes and lips. Otherwise, it was rapid sketching. The title, somewhat pretentious, was "A pause, to think of my life" (in french: Une pause, pour penser ma vie). Please, critic frankly. Thanks in advance.
Hrymfaxe
Oct 5 2008, 12:20 PM
I really like the quick lines in this - I think you have captured an interesting face without getting bogged down in the details. Did you use a very soft pencil? It almost looks like the spontaneity of charcoal. The lighting works well too. She looks like life is hard and might be aging her before her time. Well done - it is a great sketch!
paulette4
Oct 5 2008, 11:31 PM
I have to second what Marie says, great work!
FG PORTRAITS
Oct 6 2008, 03:51 AM
QUOTE (Ernest Friedman-Hill @ Oct 3 2008, 10:25 PM)

Hmmm... OK, well, I'll start. This is a little unusual for me. I do quickies that don't look this polished, and I do six-hour jobs that look nicer; this 90-minute portrait is a good compromise I rarely am able to strike. It's my son, showing off a little "snowman" he made out of tomatoes from our garden and toothpicks. I think the hand came out decently well; hands still elude me.
Click to view attachment[Edit: I replaced the original photo with a better one, now that the sun's up!]
I think that portraits need more time.
for me after 2 hours is a portrait, before is just a study or practice .
i like your critics and coments in my draws
efege.
kim1963
Oct 8 2008, 04:54 PM
I also love the loose lines Adolfo does that type of loose line work and I am a huge fan of his ....for me it is hard to critque something ment to look this way so all I can say is for a fast drawing and loose lines I wonder what could this person do with time and tighter lines
Clare B
Oct 9 2008, 02:22 PM
Click to view attachment Hi everyone, i'm new to the site.
I have recently began drawing again after a 3 year long break!
when i left home my mum told me never to stop drawing but sadly i did, this is my first attempt after this break.
constructive comments welcome!
suggestions of areas to work on?
Thanks Clare X
Hrymfaxe
Oct 9 2008, 04:05 PM
Hi Clare
Welcome back to drawing! You have a good feeling for how to build up a face, where all the features go. I wonder if you could tell us a bit more about where you would like to go with your drawing? And whether you were using a reference photo, or drawing from your imagination? Are you looking to do pieces that are very close to reality or are you working towards a style with outlines? Information like that will help us help you better.

But in any case, I can still give you a few pointers. The eyes here seem very heavy, and I figure you were drawing make-up. You can still give that expression and go easier on the outline around the eyes, and break it at some points, especially on the underlid and in the corner near the nose. It also works really well if you leave a highlight in the eyes, as it makes it clear that they are wet. I like how you have shaped the bridge of the nose by using shadows (and the shadow on the hair and neck works really well too), but the bottom looks a little crooked. And often the wings of the nose line up vertically with the corners of the eyes, so this one also seems a bit narrow.
I hope this helps a little, and do not hesitate to ask for help in specific areas if there is anything you would like to discuss.
Clare B
Oct 9 2008, 05:06 PM
Hi Hrymfaxe, thanks for your comments.
Looking at the picture now i can see the eyes are a bit heavy! I drew this picture from a small pic of a celeb, most of my portraits are from pictures, i would lke to be able to do it from a sitting. I can rarely draw people from imagination. I got into quite a sketchy type of drawing as it covers alot of mistakes! Now I want to work towards more defined real drawings. Horses were my main subjects originaly, but now portraits are taking my interest and maybe landscapes.
At the moment im focusing on practicing my shading.
Thanks Clare X
Hrymfaxe
Oct 9 2008, 06:11 PM
Hi Clare,
Life drawing is a wonderful exercise and if you are interested in this you should definitely try to find a group or a class somewhere near you. Drawing from your imagination is something that only really goes well when you know the basics from having studied them and practised.
I know what you mean about sketches being easier because you can get away with more, but there certainly is satisfaction in working intensively on a drawing and see things come together. And I can see that you are interested in shading from your drawing. Realistic drawing style really works with shading, essentially molding the subject by using values of shading from darkest black to the white of the paper, building them slowly layer by layer. It is a patient technique but worth it in the end.
QUOTE (Clare B @ Oct 9 2008, 07:06 PM)

Hi Hrymfaxe, thanks for your comments.
Looking at the picture now i can see the eyes are a bit heavy! I drew this picture from a small pic of a celeb, most of my portraits are from pictures, i would lke to be able to do it from a sitting. I can rarely draw people from imagination. I got into quite a sketchy type of drawing as it covers alot of mistakes! Now I want to work towards more defined real drawings. Horses were my main subjects originaly, but now portraits are taking my interest and maybe landscapes.
At the moment im focusing on practicing my shading.
Thanks Clare X
kim1963
Oct 9 2008, 10:59 PM
When i look at the drawing I wonder what kind of paper you are using .. it seems to pick up on all the fibers ...I have seen alot of loose line drawings and think they look very good ...this reminds me of one of those .
Brenda has alot of lessons that are for free on the site you should check them out as well as look in on a thread that interest you and ask questions post work and get alot of great feed back ....and welcome to drawspace

we love seeing new faces .
amyh9701
Oct 10 2008, 01:45 AM
I tried to draw a pic of my hubby from his boot camp pic (wallet size) and am not coming out with a good likeness and am not sure what's wrong with it. A couple things I know I did wrong were work on it in the car and do it too quickly (absolute tops was 3 hrs but I think it was closer to 2 plus I stopped for bumps) Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
ElenaM
Oct 10 2008, 02:09 AM
Hi, Amy;
from my screen comparison between photo and portrait I notice three things. First the eyes should be more shaped , the eyelid better defined, the pupils smaller and darker and the eyes less open.
The nose emphasized better, shading, values.
The mouth is well shaped but tendss to be a bit wider in the photo.
A better shading of your portrait would emphasize his features better once you address a few adjustments. Overall you have a pretty close likeness so far.
THis is my opinion as a viewer. But our maestros in portraiture will give you a better guidance how to improve your drawing.
kim1963
Oct 10 2008, 02:22 AM
Wow from a wallet picture I would say you did pretty darn good .. its hard for me to compare because of size ...when I draw a portrait i have to see detail so the image has to be a pretty nice size ...I like the drawing very well ..it is a bit bright and the blocks behind it make it even harder to see ..but I know with a better image to start with you could really produce a outstanding portrait .
Ernest Friedman-Hill
Oct 10 2008, 02:37 AM
QUOTE (amyh9701 @ Oct 9 2008, 08:45 PM)

I tried to draw a pic of my hubby from his boot camp pic (wallet size) and am not coming out with a good likeness and am not sure what's wrong with it. A couple things I know I did wrong were work on it in the car and do it too quickly (absolute tops was 3 hrs but I think it was closer to 2 plus I stopped for bumps) Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
The main issues with the likeness that I can see are (1) the nose, and along with it, the middle of the face, is stretched, and in general, the nose shape is off; and (2) the mouth is too soft and gentle in the drawing; in the photo the lips are strong, protruding, and solid-looking.
For the nose, look in the photo and compare where the tops and bottoms of the ears are in relation to the features, and then do the same for the drawing. See how the ears in the photo come to the tip of the nose, while in the drawing they're halfway down. I think this stretching and narrowing of the nose is really killing the likeness.
I think Elena's right about the irises too -- they're a bit too large.
Click to view attachmentIn this image, I overlaid your drawing on the photo. I scaled the drawing so the face is the same width, and then lined up the eyes. Note how the top of the hat and the shoulders line up, too -- that's good, it means the eyes are in the same place, and the width of the face is correct. But look how the drawn ears are higher, and how the drawn nose extends lower, and the mouth is lower too. It's this stretching out the middle of the face that I think is disrupting the likeness.
Also I note that your husband, as am I, is a proud owner of a single eyebrow - not two neat little separate ones, but hair that goes mostly all the way across. That strong, determined brow line is also part of his likeness, and so you'll have to darken and straighten those brows.
Finally, I note that you've shrunk the hat -- that dress cap is quite wide, and you've compacted it by a significant fraction in the horizontal direction.
Hope this helps!
kim1963
Oct 10 2008, 05:14 AM
I do not know if she is impressed with that but I sure am .....thats amazing how you did that Ernest ....would love to learn that trick .
Nancy B
Oct 10 2008, 12:54 PM
Good looking young man. I would like to learn that trick as well Ernest, also would like to know how to put pics side by side. I think it really helps to see things better when you use these tricks.
amyh9701
Oct 10 2008, 04:37 PM
Thank you all so much.
Ernest, I really appreciate that overlay too! Wow, it really helps to see the pics like that.

How do you do that?
Thank you Kim for your praise. I would use a bigger pic ref usually too but this is my favorite pic of my husband and so I used what I had.

I'm trying to draw him again (I think he's too dark to erase and fix on the first one unless ya'll know of any tricks... the pencil I used inside his nostrils is a 4B) And I'll post it when I get done. (give me a couple more hours, the boys and I are still doing school and this is our lunch break but I'll work on him more while the boys do their math)
Nancy - thank you, I think so too
amyh9701
Oct 10 2008, 06:31 PM
What do you think of this attempt? Did I do any better?
kim1963
Oct 10 2008, 08:14 PM
I think you have done well ...to capture exact likiness I think it is hard when the image is small ....so I say great job .
Ernest Friedman-Hill
Oct 10 2008, 08:26 PM
I think that looks WAY more like him. It's actually really hard for us to tell if you've captured a likeness because all we know about him is the one photo; your deviations from that photo may or may not have hurt the likeness. But generally, I think this looks very much like the person in the photo!
Nice job!
amyh9701
Oct 10 2008, 09:25 PM
Thank you Kim!

Thank you too Ernest. I am curious about the deviations that you mentioned. Just so I can continue to improve in general and know what to watch for in the future... I probably won't do another one.
I think one of the reasons this one was so hard was because I know my husband so well and I keep wanting to just draw what my mind's eye remembers instead of consistantly looking and measuring what I see. Thank you guys for all of your help!
Ernest Friedman-Hill
Oct 10 2008, 11:36 PM
QUOTE (amyh9701 @ Oct 10 2008, 04:25 PM)

Thank you too Ernest. I am curious about the deviations that you mentioned. Just so I can continue to improve in general and know what to watch for in the future... I probably won't do another one.
Sorry, I didn't mean I had any specific issues in mind. The only perfect rendering of a photo is a dot-for-dot copy, though, and anything else is using your brain to interpret what you see; so what I mean is that
every drawing deviates from the reference (photo or life) and only if you know what the subject really looks like can you tell whether those deviations matter or not -- that's all. From where I sit it looks like a good likeness!
Adia
Oct 12 2008, 04:41 PM
Hello,
This is my last portrait. It was a gift, as usual ... so I can't make this one better, but I will take your advices into consideration for my next one.
Took about 4-5 hours, 2B, 3B and 5B graphite.
What do you think?
kim1963
Oct 12 2008, 05:22 PM
I think you has the likiness right on .. the only thing I would work on is your dark tones ....her hair does not look like dark hair in the drawing either do her eyes ...I fear going too dark with my own work .. I am still learning

this is a amazing gift and I to always give my work as gifts .
mmmmmmme
Oct 12 2008, 05:51 PM
QUOTE (Adia @ Oct 12 2008, 12:41 PM)

Hello,
This is my last portrait. It was a gift, as usual ... so I can't make this one better, but I will take your advices into consideration for my next one.
Took about 4-5 hours, 2B, 3B and 5B graphite.
What do you think?
Adia, this is beautiful! I agree with Kim on the hair & eyes, but despite those things it still looks like the girl in the photo. It's hard for me to explain what I see in drawings, but I think you've managed to portray her inner beauty here as well as outer. Her little smile and the way her eyebrows are drawn, it really speaks more than the photo alone could. It's more expressive?

anyway good job.
Kaly
Oct 13 2008, 12:10 AM
Adia, good job, As Kim and Mindy have said, I too would have tried (I'm, still learning darks too) to darken the hair and the eyes, maybe the ear also would need a little more work. It is a beautiful gift and she will surely be very happy with it.
I too give away all my portraits as gifts, I love to give, and its always an emotion to see the surprised faces when our friends/family see we have drawn them. keep up the good work.
Adia
Oct 13 2008, 03:49 AM
Thank you Kim, Melinda and Kaly!
Regarding the dark hair and eyes ... yes, I can see what you mean. I thought about the hair too, but didn't know how to fix it so I don't ruin it

It was the first time I really drew hair carefully. I'll get better in my next ones, I promise
shay
Oct 16 2008, 11:34 PM
Hi,
Here's my attempt at a portrait, not too happy with the scan though.
C&C are welcome.
Bye.
khinchowin888
Oct 18 2008, 12:56 AM
This is my nephew Francis photo and my drawing. I think my drawing is older than the photo image.I tried three times the mouth and this is my final result and not really happy with the mouth.Should I make a bit darker his hair? His hair is very dark and thick. Welcome any advice to improve my drawing skill.
lily
Ernest Friedman-Hill
Oct 18 2008, 01:12 AM
QUOTE (shay @ Oct 16 2008, 07:34 PM)

Hi,
Here's my attempt at a portrait, not too happy with the scan though.
C&C are welcome.
Bye.
Overall, a good effort for a first portrait!
Is this from a photo, or from life, or from imagination? I ask because the light source seems somewhat inconsistent; I can't quite figure out where the light is coming from, and that's what really spoils the realism here, I think. Careful attention to how light strikes the face will be rewarded with a nice, three-dimensional looking image.
Eyelashes are funny things, by the way; they actually grow rather messier than that; they grow in clumps from which the hairs erupt at irregular angles. Overly-perfect eyelashes look strange.
Ernest Friedman-Hill
Oct 18 2008, 01:25 AM
QUOTE (khinchowin888 @ Oct 17 2008, 08:56 PM)

This is my nephew Francis photo and my drawing. I think my drawing is older than the photo image.I tried three times the mouth and this is my final result and not really happy with the mouth.Should I make a bit darker his hair? His hair is very dark and thick. Welcome any advice to improve my drawing skill.
Hi Lily,
I think you've done a nice job with a difficult reference; I like the nose and cheeks, which look very round and chubby. The likeness is good!
One error in the drawing itself: the chin seems to be a bit too pointed, and displaced to one side.
As you've heard me say before, though -- "Don't be afraid of the dark!" There are lots of places -- hair, corners of the inside of the mouth, perimeter of the face, bottom of the nose, etc -- where you could go quite a bit darker. It's not so much that you should make the hair darker, as that you should deepen the values all over the portrait.
shay
Oct 18 2008, 01:59 PM
QUOTE (Ernest Friedman-Hill @ Oct 18 2008, 04:12 AM)

Overall, a good effort for a first portrait!
Is this from a photo, or from life, or from imagination? I ask because the light source seems somewhat inconsistent; I can't quite figure out where the light is coming from, and that's what really spoils the realism here, I think. Careful attention to how light strikes the face will be rewarded with a nice, three-dimensional looking image.
Eyelashes are funny things, by the way; they actually grow rather messier than that; they grow in clumps from which the hairs erupt at irregular angles. Overly-perfect eyelashes look strange.
thanks for your comment,
this was done from a photo, here's my reference, maybe you could point out what was I doing wrong, lighting-wise, because I didn't quite got it.
thanks.
another attempt with the scanning, maybe this is better.
Ernest Friedman-Hill
Oct 18 2008, 03:16 PM
QUOTE (shay @ Oct 18 2008, 09:59 AM)

thanks for your comment,
this was done from a photo, here's my reference, maybe you could point out what was I doing wrong, lighting-wise, because I didn't quite got it.
Ah! Thanks for providing the photo -- that explains everything. Seeing the photo definitely helps me see what you were doing here and I think you did a very good job, considering.
Magazine photos (and consumer-market professional photographic portraits) like this generally make poor reference for drawing. There are multiple soft lighting sources designed to obliterate all shadow, lines, wrinkles, texture, gradations of color, etc, leaving behind flawless skin -- and not much interesting to draw. There's barely anything in the photo to indicate the roundness of the face and features; you did an excellent job with what you have.
mmmmmmme
Oct 18 2008, 03:47 PM
Shay, I think you did a nice job on this too. It's hard to decide where to put shadows when there aren't any. When I first saw your picture I figured you were trying to draw someone as a dark & sexy witch considering Halloween is coming up and all. That is a compliment by the way.
Kaly
Oct 18 2008, 04:47 PM
QUOTE (khinchowin888 @ Oct 18 2008, 01:56 AM)

This is my nephew Francis photo and my drawing. I think my drawing is older than the photo image.I tried three times the mouth and this is my final result and not really happy with the mouth.Should I make a bit darker his hair? His hair is very dark and thick. Welcome any advice to improve my drawing skill.
lily
Hi, you got the likeness allright, The scan isn't very good quality so its hard to tell, but as far as i can see, I would darken more the hair and some do some more shading on the neck area. also those lines on the eyes try to shade aroud them a little so the lines wont show, just the shadind.That is a small photo isn't it? its hard to work from a small reference photo too.
kim1963
Oct 18 2008, 07:15 PM
I agree she looks like the photo .. but as Ernest said about the lighting .. they soften up those photos so there is no real shadows to show any flaws ..in order to draw this you would have to use color pencils and where the skin tone changes you would have different colors to show that .
khinchowin888
Oct 18 2008, 08:55 PM
Ernest..thanks for the advice and I will try to shade a bit darker.
Clara... it is just the passport photo and I enlarge but real drawing is dark but may be not really dark enought, I do not know. I will upload when I fix some area. Thanks.
lily
rsine
Oct 23 2008, 03:00 AM
My advice is to choose a good reference photo, otherwise you're just making things harder for yourself.
Reidare
Oct 23 2008, 11:20 AM
Here is my humble opinion (I'm not half the good as you are):
Outlining: Her left side of the upper lip is to thin. I think its the line separating the lip and the teths that has a wrong angle. Also the tip of her cheek has an agnle a bit wrong. On the photo its going slightly upwards but on your drawing its going slightly downword. The upper part of her nose has an inward curve as you have drawn. I think you have it a bit overexagurated. Maybe you could do something with the outline of her nose, it looks a thiny bit biger than on the photo.
Otherwise I think you have done the outlining just fine. All the negative and positive spaces seems to be corect. Realy great work (wish I was that good) :-)
mechtonia
Oct 24 2008, 01:28 AM
My latest portrait. The picture I used was poor with very little contrast. C&C welcome,,,you won't hurt my feelings.
Click to view attachmentAbout 8" x 10" on Stathmore Drawing - medium paper. 4H F 3B and 5B with some 2B mechanical.
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